L/C 100 Series Electrical Problems

Submitted: Sunday, Sep 08, 2019 at 21:33
ThreadID: 139044 Views:1298 Replies:7 FollowUps:17
Was travelling the Middle Lagoon Road corrugations today when all of a sudden lost most of our guages including a/c , elec windows, indicates, tachometer, speedo radio with the exception of internal lights, hazard lights and headlights.
Can anybody offer any advice what fuse might have blown - we have checked the individual fuses which are intact.
Any help would be appreciated - vehicle is still starting and driveablr but obviously uncomfortable in heat and constant dust as we can’t open windows and no a/c in heat.
Cheers for replies.
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Reply By: Allan B (Sunshine Coast) - Sunday, Sep 08, 2019 at 21:45

Sunday, Sep 08, 2019 at 21:45
.
It is possible that it is not a blown fuse but rather a failed connection.
Vibration from the corrugations could be the reason.
The list of inoperable devices are unlikely to be from the one fuse but could share a common feed. Note that they are all ignition dependant.
Beyond that, I could only help by physical inspection and testing. Sorry.
Cheers
Allan

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Follow Up By: Allan B (Sunshine Coast) - Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 09:00

Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 09:00
.
And so the speculation begins.
Bosun, your best bet is to head to Broome and get an auto electrician to look at it because it does sound like the vehicle's control system cutting un-essential power to conserve the battery, possibly from a failed alternator supply or similar.
Whatever, you need to get to help before your vehicle is immobilised and becomes an even larger problem.
Cheers
Allan

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Reply By: RMD - Sunday, Sep 08, 2019 at 22:16

Sunday, Sep 08, 2019 at 22:16
Bosun
A mate of mine has one but I haven't taken particular notice if it has fusible link units attached to the + battery terminal for major feeds. 60's did have.
If it has one or more fusible links, usually identified by a connection to battery and a short length of, what looks like wire, then a connector, it is probably a fusible link. They can fracture due to repetitive movement and show little or no signs of damage.
To test one, remove the connector and you should have power at the connector end of it.
Alternatively the physical test of stretching it should see the link become longer and some thinning of the insulation plastic where it has broken. If so a wire of lesser dia/strands can be replacing it in the short term provided there are no short circuits currently (no pun) happening .

There may be damage to other devices. unlikely but possible.

In much older Toyotas a fusible link blowing would leave the alternator not connected to battery but to the electrical system only. One I had blow and the resulting voltage spike caused the alt reg to fail, the radio fuse blew, both high beam headlights, the electronic ignition and wiper delay unit, all at once.A Fun time.
AnswerID: 627626

Follow Up By: nick g1 - Sunday, Sep 08, 2019 at 23:12

Sunday, Sep 08, 2019 at 23:12
Yes my thoughts would be fusable link at battery too.
I had one go on me in the middle of a rocky creek crossing in an old 40 series! Got out of the creek by using short bursts of the starter motor and spend an hr trying to find the fault. I remember that one!
Other than that, l would check main electric suppy line to one of the fuse boxes.
Good luck
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FollowupID: 901735

Reply By: qldcamper - Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 06:38

Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 06:38
Chech the relays are all locked in firmly. Maybe swap the ignition/acc relays with other same number relays.
AnswerID: 627628

Reply By: Malcom M - Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 06:39

Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 06:39
Thats a common symptom of a blown alternator in the 100s

I'll only start and be driveable till your battery flattens..
AnswerID: 627629

Follow Up By: RMD - Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 08:31

Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 08:31
All those items would operate normally when starting as usual and the alternator isn't even turning at that time when key is turned on, so I can't see how it is the alternator. If it suddenly stopped while driving it is likely an electrical wiring fault.
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FollowupID: 901737

Follow Up By: Malcom M - Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 09:02

Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 09:02
Do you own a 100?
I do.
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FollowupID: 901741

Follow Up By: Geoff K4 - Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 09:35

Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 09:35
Check the wiring loom that runs over the steering column. common fault with 100 series. a wire will short out after wearing through the insulation.
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FollowupID: 901742

Follow Up By: Pepper - Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 09:35

Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 09:35
I had the same symptoms at winton qld last yea in my 2002 100 series.

Turned out to be the alternater ,changed it all is well..

Good news is you can buy new bosch and other brands of alternater for approx $200 on the net..
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FollowupID: 901743

Follow Up By: Member BarryG - Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 10:04

Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 10:04
I had the same symptoms in my 2005 Sahara TD.
Fortunately, I was only 3kms from an autoelec!
Turned out to be the fusible link (a black plastic box thing about the size of a cig pack) AND the alternator.
Cost was $845 (with an upgraded alternator) about four years ago.

Barry
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FollowupID: 901745

Follow Up By: RMD - Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 12:20

Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 12:20
Malcolm M
That is good you own one, but do ALL the items mentioned by the poster NOT work on yours until the engine starts? or are they all ok? Because that is when the alternator begins it's output and production of current and voltage. Until then, if the alt is the problem, none of those items should work when engine not running on a perfectly good vehicle. I agree the alternator will cause some to not operate though and yes alternators do fail or stop charging with simple faults. We don't know if the voltage was diminishing beforehand and below a threshold voltage for the main relay hold in though, do we? We don't know if this vehicle battery was not being charged for a while, it seems from info supplied, all ok until suddenly not ok. If alt suddenly stops charging doesn't it take a while before subsequent battery depletion causes those items to be Off?
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FollowupID: 901754

Follow Up By: Member BarryG - Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 12:23

Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 12:23
Yes Malcolm, mine was exactly the same as the original poster.
Sudden fail of instrumentation and others, but would start ok.
Barry
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FollowupID: 901755

Reply By: Geoff K4 - Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 09:36

Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 09:36
Check the wiring loom that runs over the steering column. common fault with 100 series. a wire will short out after wearing through the insulation. Often the engine won't start.
AnswerID: 627634

Reply By: Salty Dog - Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 12:52

Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 12:52
A lot of very interesting responses on here :)

I own a 100 IFS as a daily
Have chased many electrical issues

Maybe start with some better diagnostics.... or info for us

Separate both batteries and measure voltage or each separately
(no real reason, its just a good place to start)

Measure the output voltage off all fuse able links from passenger side battery

Start vehicle and re measure voltage on all fuse able links
(once alternator has engaged, a few revs might help)

Report back with findings
AnswerID: 627638

Reply By: Member - 2208mate - Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 16:52

Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 16:52
I had all those same problems recently and it turned out to be the alternator had failed and voltage was low enough to cause all sorts of weirdness.

Got an ebay 140A alternator for peanuts and yes, it's still going OK after a month hehe.
AnswerID: 627645

Follow Up By: RMD - Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 19:58

Monday, Sep 09, 2019 at 19:58
Exactly. The voltage of the system has to have been heading south and depleting the battery to have it happen. Doesn't happen the instant the the alternator fails.
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FollowupID: 901766

Follow Up By: Member BarryG - Tuesday, Sep 10, 2019 at 10:15

Tuesday, Sep 10, 2019 at 10:15
Not my experience RMD.
My battery was fine. Apparently a short had occurred in the alternator and this blew the fusible link, resulting in the exact symptoms of the original post.
Barry
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FollowupID: 901780

Follow Up By: RMD - Tuesday, Sep 10, 2019 at 19:10

Tuesday, Sep 10, 2019 at 19:10
Barry G
Did the alternator somehow short circuit first OR did the fusible link blow/break/fail and cause a resulting voltage spike which totalled the alternator. Pretty rare for an alternator to short circuit and blow a fuse/link. Many auto elects won’t diagnose or investigate which way it happens. They simply tell you the alternator caused the link failure. To blow the fusible link the alternator would have to be the paths to earth for the battery current to burn the link. We’re the diodes shorted or did a physical short of the stator wiring to negative happen?
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FollowupID: 901796

Follow Up By: qldcamper - Wednesday, Sep 11, 2019 at 00:47

Wednesday, Sep 11, 2019 at 00:47
What a load of shit RMD
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FollowupID: 901798

Follow Up By: Allan B (Sunshine Coast) - Wednesday, Sep 11, 2019 at 08:51

Wednesday, Sep 11, 2019 at 08:51
.
RMD,

As I said at the beginning...."And so the speculation begins".

Bosun has not a clue as to how this has happened or what to do about it.
Why hypothesise? It is not helpful.
As said, he needs help by physical inspection and testing before his vehicle is immobilised. Hopefully, this has happened by now, 3 days on.
Cheers
Allan

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Follow Up By: Member BarryG - Wednesday, Sep 11, 2019 at 09:42

Wednesday, Sep 11, 2019 at 09:42
RMD
The autoelec's diagnosis was that the alternator's diodes had failed first and that blew the fusible link. (My incident was not caused by corrugations - happened on smooth highway.)
Barry
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FollowupID: 901804

Follow Up By: RMD - Wednesday, Sep 11, 2019 at 13:31

Wednesday, Sep 11, 2019 at 13:31
Barry
Thanks for expanding on your experience. It seems the alt does then charge through the link.

Sad that QLDcamper doesn't recognize technical stuff.
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FollowupID: 901813

Follow Up By: qldcamper - Wednesday, Sep 11, 2019 at 15:36

Wednesday, Sep 11, 2019 at 15:36
RMD, it appears to me that it is you that doesnt understand auto electrics, i consider that I have a reasonable undetstanding of it as I have been working in the field as a qualified tradesman since 1983 and am still working as an auto elect rician.

You are the one that thinks a shorted stator winding can blow a main fuse and didnt realise that the alternator actually charges through it, demonstrating a complete lack of technical understanding of the subject that you are trying to preach about.

But you still feel you need to argue the point with someone that experienced it and basically accused either him or most of the auto sparkies offering a valueable service to the comunity of being liars.

Knowing the words doesnt mean you know what you are talking about, hands on experience is a big part that it appears you have very little of it.

There is a lot more to knowing a field than knowing how to use Google.

Please try to limit your advice to what you actually know, not think you know because you read about it, or would that leave you with very little to prattle on about?
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FollowupID: 901818

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