united fuel

Submitted: Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 17:12
ThreadID: 136066 Views:2762 Replies:9 FollowUps:23
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Have been hearing disturbing reports of poor quality of diesel from United Fuel. I have been using it for a while with no problems. But I have secondary filter which could be hiding the problem.
Any comments?
trawe
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Reply By: RMD - Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 17:23

Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 17:23
If you have been using it, is it really poor quality? because you said no problems, OR do you mean quality or good fuel which is/may be contaminated.

A filter isn't going to hide poor quality fuel only assist in filtering whatever is fed through it. If the lack of quality is present it would be the cetane value and/or the lubricity quality of the fuel.
How dirty it is is a another different issue which is handled by filtering?

You can have dirty high quality fuel and also poor quality very clean fuel.
Two issues there!
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Reply By: terryt - Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 18:52

Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 18:52
Where have you been hearing these disturbing reports? What is the substance of these disturbing reports? How many vehicles have had a problem that have been caused by this disturbingly reported poor quality fuel? Where are you? What servo do these disturbing reports relate to? I think it is a bit irresponsible to make such a comment without providing a little more information.
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Follow Up By: Member - DW Lennox Head(NSW) - Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 18:56

Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 18:56
I agree with your comments terry’s.
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Follow Up By: Mick O - Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 22:20

Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 22:20
Mobile refinery at Altona is still operating and expanding. Currently producing Diesel and Jet fuel.

Altona refinery expands
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Follow Up By: Mick O - Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 22:21

Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 22:21
Sorry, that should have been under DW's thread below. :-)

Mick
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Reply By: Member - DW Lennox Head(NSW) - Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 18:54

Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 18:54
Need to have a fair bit of proof about “poor quality” fuel. Hearsay is no good.
I doubt United would have problems and if they do so do a lot of others.
A lot of the fuel comes out of the same storage in major ports, delivered by any tanker.
No refineries left in Australia so it is very unlikely only United is involved.
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Follow Up By: D-MaxerWA - Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 20:03

Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 20:03
There is BP refinery in Kwinana, not sure of the East Coast though.
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Follow Up By: Member - McLaren3030 - Wednesday, Jan 10, 2018 at 09:41

Wednesday, Jan 10, 2018 at 09:41
DW, there are at least 4 Refineries operating on the East Coast of Australia, 2 in Vic. All producing high quality diesel. I have first hand knowledge of at least 2 occasions where United purchased bulk fuel from import that whilst passed government legislated specifications, was rejected by Mobil, BP & Shell as being “not fit for purpose”. This to me says a lot about their quality assurance programmes.

A question for the original post, are you buying your fuel from the same location? It may only be a single distributor that is “substituting” good fuel with something else. There have been a number of distributors that have been fined for this.

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Follow Up By: AlbyNSW - Wednesday, Jan 10, 2018 at 09:48

Wednesday, Jan 10, 2018 at 09:48
Interesting you say that Macca
I knew a fellow that worked at the Caltex refinery and he said that when the tankers came in they would be quality tested and any rejected loads was usually purchased by the no name guys

That comment is not directed at United though, I have no idea of how they source their fuel
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Follow Up By: Member - McLaren3030 - Wednesday, Jan 10, 2018 at 17:00

Wednesday, Jan 10, 2018 at 17:00
Alby, exactly the same circumstances for the 2 occasions that I have first hand knowledge of. Both cargos were rejected by the major oil companies, and were purchased by United.

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Reply By: Member - Stephen L (Clare SA) - Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 18:55

Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 18:55
Hi Trawe

Australia is a very big country with tens of thousands of fuel outlets.

You have not said what state you are in and the suburb/town where this so called faulty fuel is supplied to the public, or is it just hear so?


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Reply By: Gronk - Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 18:57

Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 18:57
Have heard of some operators blending stuff into fuel to maximize profits, which would mean octane or cetane may be lower, but hopefully that is rare these days.
But United and 7 Eleven would be on top of my list if I was going to suspect anyone.
Without proof, who knows.
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Follow Up By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 22:04

Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 22:04
7 Eleven are Mobil outlets... Michael
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Follow Up By: Gronk - Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 23:04

Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 23:04
7 eleven buy their fuel off Mobil. If anyone is capable of doctoring fuel on a large scale, then just as they get away with not paying their workers properly, they are capable of it.
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Reply By: swampy - Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 19:10

Sunday, Jan 07, 2018 at 19:10
hi
Have your fuel examined and u will find a lot of debris on the report.
Most filters struggle to get it out .
In old school diesel its borderline ok
In direct injection diesel ,most injectors are suffering from wear caused by debris .
Basically u need a very very large fuel filter that's as fine as or finer than the factory unit . The x tra size keeps the flow up.
Some additional filters are a waste when u donot no what the factory system uses to start with .
Some of the diesel specialists are all over this .

For most just change the filter more often than recommended . Always carry a spare on long trips .
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Reply By: Trawe - Monday, Jan 08, 2018 at 10:37

Monday, Jan 08, 2018 at 10:37
Not hearsay, proof by friends of mine had their vehicle reduce to limp mode and warning light flashing just recently. RACQ identified contamination in the fuel filter. Vehicle is less than 12 months old so can't be residue built up over time. This same friend warned me about fuel from this outlet having heard from others in his town. Despite what he had been told he continued to buy fuel from this outlet to support a local business. He won't be in the future. Seems opinion is divided. Some companies/outlets aren't beyond doctoring their product to increase profits. Others defending United. I have very expensive personal experience of "dirty" fuel in a CRD Toyota. Don't want a repeat. Too late when the filter sign lights up. Only asking.
trawe
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Follow Up By: RMD - Monday, Jan 08, 2018 at 15:47

Monday, Jan 08, 2018 at 15:47
Apart from the possibility of the seller increasing volume of his tank by adding a liquid contaminant, you have mentioned above the issue of dirty fuel, ie, unfiltered fuel being delivered to your tank.

A filter light on the dash won't be activated by Kero or petrol in the fuel, it is a sign of filter blockage caused by excessive contaminants. If it wrecks the fuel system then all the filters are not doing their job very well.

Are you sure which issue it is or is it both?
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Follow Up By: AlbyNSW - Monday, Jan 08, 2018 at 18:26

Monday, Jan 08, 2018 at 18:26
These issues are not just limited to the likes of United, I have seen the same issue with one of the premium brand outlets as well
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Follow Up By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Monday, Jan 08, 2018 at 22:41

Monday, Jan 08, 2018 at 22:41
So a normal person would take a sample and have it analysed to see what was in it. Did they have their tanks drained and the station confronted with the analysis ? Michael
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Follow Up By: Nomadic Navara - Monday, Jan 08, 2018 at 22:46

Monday, Jan 08, 2018 at 22:46
So this is fuel from one outlet. That does not necessarily mean the whole of that chain has contaminated fuel. Occasionally one station will get a dose of something in their tanks or one isolated station owner will get slack with cleanliness. This happens with all the brands not just United.

I think you are being irresponsible with your post. To blame a particular brand you need reports from many stations of the same brand.

Ten years or so there were a group of stations prosecuted for fuel doctoring. There have not been any widespread reports of that happening since.
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Follow Up By: Kazza055 - Tuesday, Jan 09, 2018 at 12:43

Tuesday, Jan 09, 2018 at 12:43
Agree with PeterD, you can't say that just because it is United that they all do it.

Makes me wonder if the OP is one of those that say they only ever use BP (or Caltex, Shell etc) and that they get heaps more K from a tank.

I use whatever shows as cheapest of "Fuelmap" and can never see any better performance for one tank to the next.

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Reply By: richard v2 - Monday, Jan 08, 2018 at 11:48

Monday, Jan 08, 2018 at 11:48
I live in WA and as recently as 3 months ago purchased 70 litres of diesel,the fuel tank hold 75 litres.the vehicle was running perfectly well on the remaining 5 litres.within five days the fuel pump and injectors were damaged to a point were the vehicle would not start,$4,900.00 later it is running fine.thankfully it was covered by my comprehensive insurance.{Budget Direct} I now have a secondary filter installed.
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Follow Up By: RMD - Monday, Jan 08, 2018 at 15:41

Monday, Jan 08, 2018 at 15:41
So was it the fuel quality or the inability of the filter to remove damaging particulates from the fuel?
If an additional fuel filter has made it ok then it has to be the rubbish getting through was the problem and probably not the quality of the fuel at all.
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Follow Up By: richard v2 - Monday, Jan 08, 2018 at 17:46

Monday, Jan 08, 2018 at 17:46
You dont understand!,After having the fuel tested to make the insurance claim it was found that metal particles,organic matter and last but not least water in the system,by the time the water alert comes on in a standard common rail fuel filter system the pump and injector have been stripped of any lubricant, so when combined with operating at 30,000psi+ it does not take long to fail.in my standard fuel system filter i was using a five micron filter,the new primary filter[secondary filter] thus is the best and only way to extract the water before the damage is done,i hope this clears things up.
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Follow Up By: RMD - Wednesday, Jan 10, 2018 at 10:29

Wednesday, Jan 10, 2018 at 10:29
From what you have just said reinforces my previous statement. Your OE filter has let through metal? and water and other contaminants to the fuel system. If it filtered the crap and dewatered the fuel then it wouldn't have happened. How often was it sreviced? Somone may never have changed the filter and it degraded and allowed rubbush through. You can get dirty fuel anywhere.
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Follow Up By: richard v2 - Wednesday, Jan 10, 2018 at 14:14

Wednesday, Jan 10, 2018 at 14:14
I change all filters when I do the oil change every 5-6000 Kay’s religiously
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Follow Up By: AlbyNSW - Wednesday, Jan 10, 2018 at 20:08

Wednesday, Jan 10, 2018 at 20:08
Water will get through any filter if it is pressurised
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Follow Up By: William P - Wednesday, Jan 10, 2018 at 20:48

Wednesday, Jan 10, 2018 at 20:48
Yes if fuel can get through - water will get through that is why to stop water getting through you need a catchment to catch the water with an alarm.
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Reply By: Member - Trouper (NSW) - Monday, Jan 08, 2018 at 16:19

Monday, Jan 08, 2018 at 16:19
My understanding is that each pump has a 'final' filter in the bowser head. near the trigger???? Maybe they are not changed as regular as they should be or maybe they have not been replaced at all, to save money!
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Follow Up By: RMD - Monday, Jan 08, 2018 at 17:24

Monday, Jan 08, 2018 at 17:24
When those filters begin to block up they are actually better than when new as they are holding back everything as well as fuel flow.
The not changing of them will mean they are either not installed, therefore never needing to be changed or the filter there, never changed, has a hole in it and lets through rubbish.
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Follow Up By: Member - Trouper (NSW) - Tuesday, Jan 09, 2018 at 13:31

Tuesday, Jan 09, 2018 at 13:31
It would be interesting to know the cost of the filters and how often they are meant to be replaced ie every 100,000 litres? or 'check them and see if they are clogged??
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Follow Up By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Thursday, Jan 11, 2018 at 19:58

Thursday, Jan 11, 2018 at 19:58
I doubt they have filters, I remember in the 60s and 70s AMOCO had a"Final Filter" fitted before the nozzle in the hose and because the fuel quality was so bad in those days, they blocked regularly. AMOCO soon dumped the filter and the advertising of the filter that set them apart from other companies at that time.
In regard to United, we have two where we live and we use both stations depending on which way we are going. We use diesel and petrol in three vehicles, I even use E10 in my 6 litre Holden with no problems. Michael
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